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USAIR Shawano - 2019 Kart Track Schedule

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  • #31
    9/10 of ownership is possession....

    (break it - you fix it, with the same $vintage$ parts)
    WELCOME TO WiR - Enjoy

    Thank You to my personal, CCS Racing sponsors: WiRiders.com, Cycle Gear, TrackGraphix.com

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    • #32
      Double check me, but it looks like a private party rented out the track from 1-4PM on the 29th...

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      • #33
        Called and have good news and bad news.

        Good news: We can go on Saturday and basically can stay on the premises and chill while the private group uses the track.

        Bad news: Called the nice fellow with questions and he immediately asked what my bike was. I was weak and didn't pull off a cheeky lie so now he knows I was trying to bring an SV. Long story short, there's now a limit of 250cc for sportbikes but up to 900cc(!!!) for "Supermoto" bikes. He also said it "wasn't up for debate" even though the definition of a supermoto is loose. I think it's a matter of insurance saying "clipons bad, fairings bad."

        So basically, the KTM 900cc "Supermoto" is permissible because it's marketed as a Supermoto. I asked if I take the fairings off my SV nad use the raiser bars if it counts as a supermoto and he said "No! It's a sportbike." It sounds arbitrary since SM is more just a marketing term and the strictest definition of a SM bike is a converted dirt bike with 17 inch wheels. Apparently it's for insurance reasons. A hypermotard or KTM 920 is not a converted dirt bike so, by definition, isn't a supermoto.

        Literally, a naked SV650 is closer to a supermoto than the KTM 920cc.

        The one valid argument I can see is that supermotos are more crash proof and sportbikes tend to leave bits when you crash them. But a Ducati Hypermotard would equally be as liable to leave bits...

        So....hoping I didn't ruin it for everyone. But if he's gonna be a stick in the mud about it then I probably won't go. Maybe I'll go to RA with STT....

        Bright side is I was planning on getting a supermoto anyway...

        Anyone have a little bike they want to sell or let me borrow???

        Edit: Jesus H, the 900 (or whatever) CC KTM makes just about 100 HP....and weighs 423 lbs.

        So literally, the only way this could be run and not an SV is if insurance explicitly outlaws clipons/fairings/bikes marketed as sportbikes.

        The guy said he didn't want to get into "semantics" with me, but I'd rather not make a $3-5k decision to run at his track if he can't even define what is allowable. Maybe I'll write to Suzuki and say if I put on bush guards to designate my SV's VIN as an official "SM" version.
        Last edited by Woozuki; 06-27-2019, 03:18 PM.

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        • #34
          If that's really the case, Ninja 300's and R3's are no longer allowed there either. That kinda puts a damper on the fun for a lot of you guys. Well we still have Road America Motorplex.

          We can cancel this weekend but let me work on this issue to see if I can get it resolved.

          John K - Appleton

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          • #35
            I bet he got dinged by some asshole making an insurance claim. Insurance companies suck and their definitions of "sport bikes" is as terrible as the "black guns are evil" definition that ignorant people go by.

            I'm sure he wants to allow any and all bikes to get more customers more money. But at some point insurance is going to start requiring corner workers, tech inspections, control riders, ambulance crews, and everything else trackday orgs are required to carry.
            2004 BMW R1100SA(street/Deer Spear)
            2008 Suzuki SV650 (track\race CCS AM#259)

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            • #36
              We could all get karts

              https://milwaukee.craigslist.org/mcy...902452377.html
              You should see me in a headsock !

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              • #37
                Stop suggesting carts!
                Last edited by Tammy; 06-27-2019, 08:26 PM.
                2004 BMW R1100SA(street/Deer Spear)
                2008 Suzuki SV650 (track\race CCS AM#259)

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                • #38
                  I think Pat just saw a TV story where "sport bike riders" beat up a Range Rover driver in New York, and he doesn't want those guys to show up at the race track. That whole insurance thing is just cover for the fact that he has a stick up his butt for sport bikes. Meanwhile, drifter cars are crashing into barriers and tearing their whole bumpers off, flinging them across the race track, and just generally wrecking the place.

                  Just so it's clear to everyone here, Pat and Ann don't own the track. They are employees paid to run maintain it. Since Pat is clearly not willing to work with reasonable adult sportbike riders, I'll be hunting down the track owners to discuss the issue. My goal is to present the entire CCS lightweight and ultralight class as possibilities along with the entire rule structure for how bikes need to be set up for safety. It would make things very well defined and leave nothing for Pat to decide, depending on his mood. Wish me luck.

                  Originally posted by Rocky5000100 View Post
                  That has been on my mind for a long time. You realize those things reach cornering forces of 2 G's? ooh yeah.
                  John K - Appleton

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                  • #39
                    $4000 cart???

                    HELLZ NO !

                    We should focus on Grom, Z125 Pro, Kymco K-Pipe


                    O-A-R:

                    An SSR Razkull = $2100 msrp
                    http://www.ssrmotorsports.com/store/street/razkull.php


                    $1999 in Darien, WI (near TSE)
                    https://maxxxmotorsports.com/Motorcy...4-a916014a7628

                    ----------------
                    Used with 258 miles on it - $1699
                    https://motorcycles.autotrader.com/m..._125/200728237
                    Last edited by Spoot; 06-27-2019, 06:40 PM.
                    WELCOME TO WiR - Enjoy

                    Thank You to my personal, CCS Racing sponsors: WiRiders.com, Cycle Gear, TrackGraphix.com

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Mini Monsters! I wonder how they handle. Groms handle like crap and have no cornering clearance. Z125's actually have pretty decent suspension from the factory and all they really need is tires and thicker front fork oil. Southeast Sales still has them for $2222 as of this writing...
                      John K - Appleton

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Zaph View Post
                        I think Pat just saw a TV story where "sport bike riders" beat up a Range Rover driver in New York, and he doesn't want those guys to show up at the race track. That whole insurance thing is just cover for the fact that he has a stick up his butt for sport bikes. Meanwhile, drifter cars are crashing into barriers and tearing their whole bumpers off, flinging them across the race track, and just generally wrecking the place.

                        Just so it's clear to everyone here, Pat and Ann don't own the track. They are employees paid to run maintain it. Since Pat is clearly not willing to work with reasonable adult sportbike riders, I'll be hunting down the track owners to discuss the issue.
                        Zaph, you have a relationship with the owner? Didn't know that. We're all pulling for you! I'm sure the owner will be thrilled to hear how one of his employees is arbitrarily discriminating against new and potentially very loyal customers (even if it is chump change for him) based on making up hair-brained rules motivated by a youtube video. Unbelievable.

                        I won't push my luck with Pat anymore because the more I talked with him trying to understand what kind of bike I "need", the more hellbent he seemed on never letting me run there. Thankfully, he doesn't have my name, so I'll just speak with an accent around him from now on. Also doesn't know anything about bikes if he can equivocate a literbike ADV to real supermotos but not let 251+cc sportbikes run....

                        Was thinking about emailing the general "info" address with a request for the specific insurance contractual clause that specifies bike type in hope of nailing him down but I won't because then I'm afraid they actually would define something disadvantageous.

                        I'm just upset because I was so excited to learn on a lower speed course and get my cornering consistent in a lower pressure environment (track days being what they are). Alright though, Road America is nice and slow and safe

                        Those deals on Z's look really enticing though....that's like, used mountain bike prices. Y'all wanna start our own Z/mini racing series (because Grom's are overplayed)?

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Woozuki View Post

                          I'm just upset because I was so excited to learn on a lower speed course and get my cornering consistent in a lower pressure environment (track days being what they are). Alright though, Road America is nice and slow and safe

                          Those deals on Z's look really enticing though....that's like, used mountain bike prices. Y'all wanna start our own Z/mini racing series (because Grom's are overplayed)?
                          USAIR makes me feel like I barely know what I'm doing...especially when anybody else is out there and I can't keep up. Tight but fun still.

                          RA Kart track is tighter and makes me feel like I barely know what I'm doing, and that I'm on the wrong bike! I kinda want to try a supermoto for a few years and RA makes me want that even more.

                          The pit bikes Grom/Z-125 seem sweet for both, though.
                          Matt J., Appleton
                          2015 Yamaha R3
                          Instagram- @motomatt_r3

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Woozuki View Post
                            Zaph, you have a relationship with the owner? Didn't know that.
                            No, I just know who it is. When I get some time I will try to connect and see what I can do. There's a whole market out there to tap into - guys who want track time but not $150-$200 track days. Guys who want more practice seat time than CCS can offer. Mostly I just want to get my non-supermoto/mini buddies on the track that I still ride often.

                            I come from supermoto and may be getting back on one soon. Just found my old greetings post on this forum... check out those beauties I had. I miss them. But a Z125 is fun too.
                            John K - Appleton

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Zaph View Post

                              I come from supermoto and may be getting back on one soon. Just found my old greetings post on this forum... check out those beauties I had. I miss them. But a Z125 is fun too.
                              I'd absolutely be willing to get into it with you (and force myself under your wing )! I frequently peruse Craigslist for a SM. Not really sure what I should get. Probably go with something easy and trusted like a DRZ-400 rather than someone's do-it-yourself kit. I really know nothing about it, though, compared to other disciplines (which is really saying something considering how little I know about anything).

                              I always thought SM would be a great way to learn the limits of traction at a slower and more forgiving speed with a slower and more forgiving bike. Tons of pros learn and train this way, and I've always thought building up to do an SM race would be a hoot. Do they still have the dirt part of their SM track? It kind of looks paved over on google earth.
                              Last edited by Woozuki; 07-01-2019, 07:13 AM.

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Woozuki View Post

                                I'd absolutely be willing to get into it with you (and force myself under your wing )!
                                Whelp, that sounds questionable out of context....

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